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Well, the Gaza withdrawals (I wouldn't call it a deportation) might be a step in the direction of lasting peace between the Israelis and Palestinians. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be very popular with the Israelis (particularly, of course, those who live in Gaza), and it looks as though most will refuse to leave before the Wednesday deadline. This means that military action will be necessary to "persuade" them to leave, which may well lead to bloodshed on both sides. Add to that the possibility of Palestinian action against those Israelis who refuse to leave, and the situation is extremely volatile. The next few days and weeks will be very telling vis-a-vis the longterm success of this operation (by that I mean the entire peace process). I have my doubts.
I agree, uprooting people is not a constructive solution.
Edited By carefulwiththataxeEugene on 1124129227
Alternate Gilmour Wrote:How many of you agree with the deportations in the Gaza?
When you strip away many of the political layers of this issue you find key elements that are common to our topic.
Well..I have only limited sympathy for the Israeli`s uprooted.
Crying for the Palestinians originally displaced is one thing.., crying for yourself because you`re having to give back the extra land you stole in 1967,(being allowed to keep the land you stole in 1948); because of some spurious, tenuous drivel in the Bible about it "naturally" being your homeland...that I have limited sympathy for.
There are at least 2 UN resolutions that say that the Israeli settlements in the densely populated Gaza, and especially the West Bank, are illegal. I don`t see us steaming in there, in response to THOSE resolutions, however - the Jewish lobby in the US prevents that. Yet we can prosecute an illegal war, quite readily, on the flimsiest of pretexts, when there are reasons (false) which "suit" us, WITHOUT a proper UN mandate.
My guess on Gaza City (95% Arab anyway), is that Sharon is attempting to placate criticism of Israeli imperialism (there`s no other word for it), by dismantling the few settlements that are there; in an attempt to deflect attention from all the settlements on Palestinian land further east - some of which are so far into the West Bank, they`re almost in the River Jordan & the Dead Sea. This "scattered" occupation purposefully making any eventual land hand-back extremely difficult, in fact nigh on impossible.
....and people wonder why a nineteen-year-old Palestinian paramedic, who`s just seen her ten-year-old brother shot dead by an Israeli soldier for throwing a stone at a tank, would want to blow herself up on an Israeli bus.
-That "off-the-fence" enough AG?
Edited By Philintheflesh on 1124147502
In defense of AG and all other Americans, we love to debate issues. We don't feel it's controversial as much as we feel we are exercising our first amendment. (freedom of speech) So for those of you that are polite and a bit restrained, please remember, we Americans are no such thing. hahahahaha
carefulwiththataxeEugene Wrote:...and it looks as though most will refuse to leave before the Wednesday deadline...
I think most are gone - it's the really emotionally attached who will fight it, and that's where it's going to be messy. I expect to see some commit suicide, some may hole themselves up and shoot at the Israeli soldiers. I think it will be extremely ugly for a very few.
Anyone remember the six day war?
Philintheflesh Wrote:Well..I have only limited sympathy for the Israeli`s uprooted.
Crying for the Palestinians originally displaced is one thing.., crying for yourself because you`re having to give back the extra land you stole in 1967,(being allowed to keep the land you stole in 1948); because of some spurious, tenuous drivel in the Bible about it "naturally" being your homeland...that I have limited sympathy for.
There are at least 2 UN resolutions that say that the Israeli settlements in the densely populated Gaza, and especially the West Bank, are illegal. I don`t see us steaming in there, in response to THOSE resolutions, however - the Jewish lobby in the US prevents that. Yet we can prosecute an illegal war, quite readily, on the flimsiest of pretexts, when there are reasons (false) which "suit" us, WITHOUT a proper UN mandate.
My guess on Gaza City (95% Arab anyway), is that Sharon is attempting to placate criticism of Israeli imperialism (there`s no other word for it), by dismantling the few settlements that are there; in an attempt to deflect attention from all the settlements on Palestinian land further east - some of which are so far into the West Bank, they`re almost in the River Jordan & the Dead Sea. This "scattered" occupation purposefully making any eventual land hand-back extremely difficult, in fact nigh on impossible.
....and people wonder why a nineteen-year-old Palestinian paramedic, who`s just seen her ten-year-old brother shot dead by an Israeli soldier for throwing a stone at a tank, would want to blow herself up on an Israeli bus.
-That "off-the-fence" enough AG?
Interesting points, and I have heard similar sentiments before. I'd heard the Jews from Europe after WWII were being taken all over the place, and finally placed on the beach, and they asked the Palestinians for a home - and Palestine welcomed them (or allowed them to stay while the Allied navies were close-by - depending on who tells you the story). Then, as the Israelis were settling in, they didn't like the third-world accomodations and backward government, they decided to push for change (or showed their gratitude to the Palestinians by seizing land for their own, depending on who tells you). Then, Egypt and several other countries went after Israel to get them to back off, so Israel defeated them in battle and took the land as a spoil of war (or the Israelis stole EVEN MORE land, depending on who tells you). It's odd how two people who were BOTH there in RECENT times can tell such different stories - and I know SOME people on BOTH sides tend to be like kids - they dramatize their plight for all its worth. I, for one, want the truth. Unfortunately, I think it goes a LOT farther back than any of us can ever find out what really happened.
"You want the TRUTH??? You can't HANDLE the truth!"
No, I not only could handle it, I welcome it!
I saw an interesting interview about this issue on Sunday morning, and this rather prominent expert on the subject said the Bible is a poor document to use for real-estate deals (to which I agree), and this is a painful but necessary step that Israel is taking. He made sense to me on those points.
As a final note, it will be a long time before we know if Israel's withdrawal from Gaza was a wise choice; and it will be a comparatively SHORT time to find out if it was an UNwise choice. Such is the nature of decision-making. Did you ever notice how the greatest leaders were considered bad in their time, but as years passed, the fruits matured on the vines they planted?
GRAPHITE_BLIMPS Wrote:all this will cause are revolts and a possible WWIII. I mean how can you just seperate all these people from their freinds, jobs and lives. Its immoral and will only cause problems. Canada is nice enough to stay as a haven for refugees kicked out of their countries.
Graphite:
I'm not sure, but I don't think a lot of people are being separated from family and friends - I think they're being pulled away from gorgeous beach-front property in Gaza and will end up living closer to the Dead Sea in the West Bank. I don't think Israel will have so many riots and revolts, and the Palestinians are HAPPY.
Eventually, I'd think the Palestinians will sell some of their land in Gaza to the highest bidders, and it will end up belonging to Saudi playboys! :)
Seriously, that IS prime real estate that the Israelis are giving up for the Palestinians, and I really think the Palestinians should have a nice, tall, refreshing glass of "Shut The Hell Up" (instead of complaining, as I read some were doing) now that they're getting it - negotiate later for some of the West Bank, but it's through good negotiations and peaceful actions that you get the good things you deserve. Hamas didn't get Gaza back for Palestine - it was Arafat and Hamas who delayed it. Of course, that's the observation I have made; I could be wrong.
Close this idiotic thread. It's stupid for someone to even think that it would be a good idea to kick people out of a country because of their origin.
I'm surprised people have actually discussed why it's a bad idea, it's obvious this guy is a little mentally retarded.
Edited By Intergalactic on 1124155519
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