Human nature is something you can not change, that's the big problem. If everybody gets paid the same, everybody will have the urge to get paid more by doing more, or to laze around, which logically should make them earn less. The result is capitalism. There's no way to avoid that.

Also, about Lady Floydian's point concerning dictatorships: She's partly right, but mixes causality and correlation. Communism doesn't require dictatorship, and many European countries have democratic parties that promote communism. The reason why all communist systems to date had dictators, was because they weren't voted for; they took power in those countries through wars and revolutions, then enforced their rules onto the people. If a country's voters decide that communism is a good idea, then it's perfectly possible for it to happen without dictatorship.

(04-07-2011 06:08 AM)Joe Wrote:  Oh, and also...equality is a utopian dream, and I hope you grow back into it.

There's a difference between wanting to lower the inequity that exists in society, and thinking the only way to get there is to institute a quasi-anarchist, communist state. The best combination you could have, in regards to an economic state within your country, is a mixture of both capitalism and socialism. Socialism =/= communism, by the by. A lot of countries, the United States included, have aspects of both a capitalist society and a socialist society. What is important is maintaining a reasonable balance between the amount of each you employ. If I've said it once, I've said it a dozen times -- You cannot fix what is broken or doesn't work by swinging the pendulum to the other extreme. It doesn't work, and it will never work.

Utopian by definition means both idealized perfection and unrealistic and impractical dreams of said perfection. Perfection cannot exist, because humans are not perfect. Humans are humans, and thus fallible. So while this utopian landscape you seem to think can exist is nice to think about......it is by its own definition, unable to exist.

So why don't we try working on making the less-fortunate in all societies live a better quality of life? Sounds like a more reasonable and practical plan.

(04-07-2011 11:18 AM)Arno Sluismans Wrote:  Human nature is something you can not change, that's the big problem. If everybody gets paid the same, everybody will have the urge to get paid more by doing more, or to laze around, which logically should make them earn less. The result is capitalism. There's no way to avoid that.

I'll have to stand refuted. I cannot counter argue that.

(04-07-2011 11:26 AM)Lady Floydian Wrote:  Utopian by definition means both idealized perfection and unrealistic and impractical dreams of said perfection. Perfection cannot exist, because humans are not perfect. Humans are humans, and thus fallible. So while this utopian landscape you seem to think can exist is nice to think about......it is by its own definition, unable to exist.

I understand. Your view is kind of depressing, but realistic.

I'm nothing on the political front, I don't really care what happens out there because mine and anyone else's input will never change the corruption and evilness this world suffers. I'm happy in my own little world and it's how I choose to live it that counts. Until individuals realise the truth of life this world remains in the hands of bad people.
'And what is the truth?' it's here, now, you just have to look in the right places. Humans are capable of astounding feats and we are all more powerful than we realise, we have yet to fully appreciate our limits, our strengths and our desires. Somewhere along the way we have lost the whole idea of our existance even when we were given 'hints' in the past, some though do carry with them the ideal truth and lead wonderful happy lives despite everything.